EVE Online

Here's my random topic for the day.. the things I see discussed the most on this forum, and why they should make you want to try Eve, or not, as the case may be.  Eve's not for everyone, doesn't try to be, doesn't seem to want to be.  But if it's for you you'll have a hard time going back to more traditional MMOs :)

True Sandbox Gameplay

Pros:

• No predefined progression.  Players in Eve do what they want.
• No real concept of 'end game', just the game.  Players who want to do something are usually able to just go do it.  Even if they can't do it alone they can contribute to a group without needing some predefined SP minimum.
• Nobody is useless.
• No obsolete content.  Nothing in Eve is ever superceeded when a new expansion comes out, new content exists alongside the old.
• It's not about loot - equipment in Eve is the means to the end, not the end in itself.  And anything can be bought and sold, none of this binding nonsense.

Cons:

• Difficult for new players to establish themselves without the aid of a player corporation.  Soloing in Eve is never easy, but it's particularly brutal for a brand-new no-prior-experience character.
• Some people find the lack of direction confusing, or can't find anything to do without an NPC or player telling them to do it.
• Self-directed nature of Eve unfortunately means that players with a defeatist attitude are their own worst enemies.
• There's so much to the game that has to be mastered right away that it gives Eve its legendary cliff-shaped learning curve.

Real-Time Skill-Based System

Pros:

• No grinding for skills. 
• Very casual-friendly since you don't have to play to advance your skills.
• Most specializations (which can be thought of as being roughly akin to classes) can be mastered in about six months.  Having more specializations makes a character more versatile, not directly more powerful.

Cons: 

• You'll never catch up in raw SP total to older players. 
• People who don't specialize heavily will never be very good at anything.
• Some advanced specializations take years to be effective at.
• Training mechanics discourage use of same-account alts.  Most people with alts use multiple accounts for them.

Deep, Meaningful PvP Mechanics

Pros:

• Steep death penalties make zerg tactics completely unviable.
• PvP affects the game world in a meaningful way by securing territory and resources.
• Realistic - exploded ships are gone forever and some loot can be salvaged from the wreck.
• Every ship class has a role and is capable of defending itself, ensuring new players can jump in right away and older players aren't relegated to massive, hulking behemoths unless they want to be.

Cons:

• Steep death penalties tend to be particularly rough on new players who are still learning the ropes and thus prone to making 'stupid' mistakes because they don't know any better.
• PvP can become a very expensive for a player who loses a lot of ships.
• Lack of true safe areas can be a turn-off for some people.
• Steep death penalties and heavy emphasis on use of sound strategy and tactics make the pvp game move at a glacial pace compared to other games.  Actual combat comprises only a tiny fraction of the pvp-game.

Single-Shard World

Pros:

• The game world is enormous.
• Game mechanics encourage people to spread out.  Players can base themselves just about anywhere and no system is valueless simply because it's high security or happens to be a noob starter system.
• Functional economy - all ships and most modules are player manufactured, with people harvesting resources, builing intermediary items, finished products, with trade and shipping going on at every stage.
• Player-Nations.  Large player alliances can claim sovereignty over non-empire space (which makes up the majority of space in the game).

Cons:

• Your past deeds will follow you forever.  For good or ill.
• Travel takes a long time compared to some games, especially in slow ships.
• Little variety - every system is pretty much the same, with the exception of some well-defined parameters that vary by system.
• Busy market hubs and large fleet fights can lag terribly at times.

Some good points but with a few inaccuracy's like the comment about zerg tactics, a blob is unfortunately one of the most powerful pvp tools, from low skilled T1 swarms that goons and E-uni employ to experienced older players using frigate swarms like PL using a titan jump bridge to spew 50 rifters on top of gate camps for a laugh and in both these cases they can destroy billions in expensive ships and fittings for minimal losses.

Interesting post, good read.

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Originally posted by x_rast_x

Cons:

Your past deeds will follow you forever.  For good or ill.

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Isn't that a pro? If you act like an asshole, people will remember you for it, if you play nice, people will remember you. Imo that's awesome, all your actions even in chat can have consequences.

There's so much to the game that has to be mastered right away that it gives Eve its legendary cliff-shaped learning curve.

This is a pro to me.

I like how it weeds out the non eve-types pretty fast

I disagree with the following:

"Travel takes a long time compared to some games, especially in slow ships. " - I don`t think it is slow at all. What do you mean by...slow ships?

"# People who don't specialize heavily will never be very good at anything." Can you be good at a FPS without a LOT of practice?

"# Some advanced specializations take years to be effective at." Years?...NO. Maybe a few months. (Of course if you don`t chose to specialize in flying a capital ship)

"Training mechanics discourage use of same-account alts. Most people with alts use multiple accounts for them." I think that`s a pro. One player - one account - one character. You are one entity in game.

"Difficult for new players to establish themselves without the aid of a player corporation. Soloing in Eve is never easy, but it's particularly brutal for a brand-new no-prior-experience character." Wrong! You are soloing in the wrong place.

"Some people find the lack of direction confusing, or can't find anything to do without an NPC or player telling them to do it." Do you like someone to dictate what to do in your life too?

"PvP can become a very expensive for a player who loses a lot of ships." PvP can be verry profitable for someone who distroys a lot of other ships.

"Lack of true safe areas can be a turn-off for some people." You are safe in high-sec if you are in an NPC corp. (well...99%)

This is only my point of view.

I would really ike to thank the original poster and everybody who offered advice or feedback in their replies. I was coming to ask a series of questions as I haven't played Eve in a VERY long time. Just about everything I wanted to know was addressed here. Although it was addressed I would like to ask one question that was addressed above for more detailed insight.

The primary reason I left EVE is I was coming from WOW, my very first MMO. I didn't like the idea that I couldn't grind to earn my way to the top. A couple years having passed now and with much expeirence with MMO's behind me I am intersted in EVE once again. My question is this: How big of an impact does the time based training system have on new players? Is somebody joining EVE right now, especially with the games healthy long standing subscriber base, always going to have a bit of trouble?

Can a new player really become elite in some respect within three to six months of training, assuming you are specializing in something. All of these questions assume the new player has common sense, picks up the the system fairly easily, and is the type to flourish in a sandbox setting. My real concern is being an ant among Gods unless my skill and foresight are so highly tuned that I can outwit many of the older subscribers.

Mulisiphix the short answer to your question is No.

Ignore the troll (one of many) as Elsabolts doesnt actually play, or understand EVE. The answer is yes, within 6 months you can be a very good pilot for pretty much any ship if you specialise. Battleships and larger will take longer unless you pick something like a Raven (in which case 3 months is enough). You can fit into and fly HACs and Recons very well after 6 months, tech1 cruisers and battlecruisers after 2 or so months. Thats what most people fly in PvP.

If you wanted to jump in even quicker, head straight for interceptors, you should be able to fit into an interceptor within a few weeks of starting.

I'm disappointed I forgot to add this bit of information as it is crucial in supplying an answer. My primary desire in the game would be to join a corporation and do a lot of cooperative gaming. This could be anything from being a pirate to being being a pirate hunter to providing deep space mining security. Just about anything I consider to be attractive in the game puts me into the combat seat. I'm not really familiar with what defines Tech 1 or 2 or the different ships. Like I said earlier, given my interest I'm afraid of getting owned everywhere I go or being so ill defined, training skills, that no corporation would seriously use me for more than cannon fodder on various corp based objectives/missions. Thoughts?