General Discussion

MMORPG PvP is a carebear-ified version of FPS (read: Twitch) combat.  in every MMORPG.

that's not to say that I don't enjoy playing PvP in MMOs, because I do. but I have to laugh out loud, when I see some random person on a forum crowing about PVP skill and being "hardcore PvP" in a MMORPG.

any game where your level and gear give add significantly to your effectiveness as a player is carebear. and that's pretty much every MMO out there. 

regardless of what the super-loud PvP crowd screams and shouts, PvP MMORPGs will always be less popular *overall* than PVE-focused ones. sadly, PvP in MMORPGs is reduced to and defined by "ganking" and immature, insecure brats with no purpose in life but to ruin your gameplay experience,  in general.  that alone makes PVE games more popular.   there is and can be much, much more to PvP than that, of course. but that's how the average player thinks of PvP.

MMOFPS on the other hand....but very few of the "real hardcore PVPers" in the MMORPG genre really want or can handle that, otherwise Planetside would have been much, much more of a success than it was and the MMOFPS genre would have flourished. that is, if the REAL HARDCORE Pvpers(lol) were really interested in real PvP.

they want a game they can attack someone at 30% health who isn't in a position to fight back.  that's not PvP, in my opinion. that's just Carebears-in-denial ganking other Carebears.

if you want REAL PvP, you play a Multi-Player game that is twitch-based, and evenly balanced, where your personal skill and the skill of your team/group/faction is the deciding factor every time. not gear, not levels, not spells and special attacks.

if you play a gear/equipment/level/diceroll based MMORPG, and thump your chest about PvP, You are just as much of a Carebear as everyone else. the difference is, you are just in Denial, and other people readily embrace their carebearness.

Originally posted by Blodpls

If someone could make a mmorpg that would inspire the vast untapped masses of pvp gamers to pay $15 a month it would be the pvp game.

Who in gods name would pay to play a silly PvP game when there are so many FREE to play ALT + TAB games out now, not to mention the extra added bonus of Bot programs now built it.

Get with the times IT"S freee ee ee and made in China LMAO, free will cost ya 5 x the price of any 15$ a month to play. lalalalal.  hehehehe

Originally posted by ZANGFEI

 

Who in gods name would pay to play a silly PvP game when there are so many FREE to play ALT + TAB games out now, not to mention the extra added bonus of Bot programs now built it.

Get with the times IT"S freee ee ee and made in China LMAO, free will cost ya 5 x the price of any 15$ a month to play. lalalalal.  hehehehe

Yes but they aren't playing free Chinese games they playing these games, there's almost 2 World of Warcrafts worth of players there based on minutes played, and thats just pc gamers from western world alone:

/flame suit on

Call of Duty 4: Modern Warfare Multiplayer

8,358,289

Call of Duty 2 Multiplayer

5,431,011

Call of Duty: World at War Multiplayer

3,165,141

Counter-Strike: Source

2,310,857

Battlefield 2

1,513,498

Warcraft III - The Frozen Throne

1,205,437

Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory

911,883

If you could make even 25% (or 5% even) of these people cough up $15 a month by providing persistance to their game you would be on to a winner.  People using Xbox to play some of these game are already paying so it's not as if non mmorpg people can't be made to pay.  If I was designing a new mmorpg it would be a rpg / fps hybrid pvp game and on console.

Originally posted by Zayne3145

Originally posted by Sabiancym

Originally posted by Zayne3145

Both would sell well tbh, but I would personally buy PvE only as I'm not really interested in PvP at all. If I want PvP gameplay I'd go play CoD or something.

 

That is the most retarded argument against pvp, and it gets thrown around so often by the carebear crowd.

 

Yes, I used the C word.

 

Perhaps you would care to enlighten me as to why that argument is 'retarded' as you so eloquently put it?

It's perfectly valid because most MMOs have retarded pvp - it's that simple.

Die, respawn, die,  respawn, die, respawn, die, respawn.  Collect gear.  Rinse.  Repeat.

I have seen exactly one MMO that has pvp that makes sense within an MMO context - Eve.  And.. well.. it's a game I love but it's most definately *not* for everyone.

Most pvp'ers really are better off playing Counterstrike (the other C word), sadly.

Imo there are alot more players that enjoy Pve gameplay than Pvp.

Raids, questing, crafting/gathering people love this shit way more than Instanced pvp and world pvp.

Think players play a game like WoW for pvp?!? LOL! no way. the majority of wows playerbase is on a pve server. they love raiding ..... the majority of them anyway.

Imagine if wow had nothing but faction pvp, battlegrounds and world pvp objectives. the game would have about 2-3 million players world wide at the most.

Which is sad imo, the games I enjoy are ones that actually revolve around pvp, the pve in my games exist to let players farm cash or craft to pay for pvpers lost gear.

PvE is by far more popular in MMORPG's. I love PvP but not in my MMO's. FPS games have by far a higher quality of PvP than any MMORPG ever will have. Even fighting games are better PvP. Its a nightmare to truely get class balance in an mmo unlike the ease of geting guns balanced in FPS.

IMO PvP'ers are "a fish out of water" in an MMORPG. Like I said other genres gives sooooooooooo much beter PvP quality. MMO pvpers always complain about skill vs gear. well in a fps skill is what matters, gear doesnt. So in short when I have a PvP erge I throw in CoD4 or Socom confronttion, or PvE I boot up an MMORPG, or an old fashion JRPG.

I think intial sales a pvp game would sell more boxes. I think a PVE game would have better stability and keep subscribers longer.

My only beef with with pve/pvp games is when my character is changed due to pvp balancing. I dont pvp and never will. Just not my cup of tea , but sure doesnt mean i feel that pvp shouldnt be in agame if its done fairly.

But back to the subject, i think pvp demands more from the game because of constant balancing of classes so as not to see a server full of 1 class or build.

Its hard to say.  WoW suffers a bit because Blizzard mixes the two.  Alot of people here say WoW is easy because they've never tried to level on a PVP server.  Try doing the same quests and level at the same pace on a PVP server.  All of a sudden WoW's not so easy anymore.

The best arguement for PVP-only is you can mail in the content.  Create 4 or 5 simple PVP zones and the PVP kiddies will live in them, killing each other mindlessly for hours on end. 

Designing quests, scripts and deep content for PVE costs alot more money and requires alot more development time.

O look Im playing the same person in a new arena.... o boy.

PvE can have some diversity. I think PvP is locked with basicly new skins battle areas. PvE can create a epic story.