Profile: Pyro2008
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• • Warhammer Online : Age of Reckoning: Jacobs on GOA, Forums and Accountability

  • Originally posted by NotArkard
    

    Originally posted by Pyro2008
    

    Originally posted by NotArkard
    

    Very well said, Mark. You should know that most of us who have played DAoC understand that we do not need official forums to form a community. Communities are formed within the game, and while at this time, everyone's off doing their own thing, eventually things will settle down like they did in DAoC. Known players will be known within the game on their own server, and they don't need to go off posting "I KILLED X PLAYER 10 TIMES IN RVR LOLOLOL I'M SO GOOD" threads on any official forum.

     

    Those who don't understand what a community is really like, or haven't played DAoC, as you said will vote with their credit card. Maybe they'll go back to reading awesome threads on the WoW forums such as:

     

    1. "LOLOL THORI'DAL WENT TO A ROGUE"

    2. @LEGOLESS I PWNT U!!111!

    And so on, and so forth.

     
    
    I couldn't agree with you more ...

     

    Oh wait, I don't agree. Why? Because War's in game chat system is clunky, buggy and just overall doesn't provide a communicative experience.

    
    Personally, at this point I would just prefer a better in game chat system although I still would like an official forum. Problem is, how do I relay my distaste for their in game chat system? I guess I could submit feedback in game that will get lost in the millions or if there were a forum I could create a post for such an issue and hope to get many other users to support the same idea. An idea that is supported goes farther than just one person alone.

    
    Sure, you are going to get people being rude on an official forum ... just as you will an unofficial. The only difference is that Mythic isn't the one having to moderate at that point. Also, if they actually read the unofficial forums as they claim to, they are going to read the same nasty posts as they would have on an official forum. One difference being, depending on the moderation rules of the site, the nasty posts may just stay there to continuously slap Mythic in the face.

    
    What this is really about is accountability, money and laziness. They don't want to spend money on a forum when they can have unofficial sites do their work for them. Then, when people start posting reasonable requests/feedback, Mythic can simply claim not to have seen the posts and not been aware of the issues. In one swing they have given up accountability and shown how lazy they really are.

    
    It's like a car manufacturer trying to sell a car without a warranty. They don't want to be accountable for the problems that may occur and have to spend revenue to fix the problems.

    
    With an MMO, we get no warranty. Matter of fact, we have to sign an EULA telling us exactly what we CANNOT DO with the software we just spent our money on. So if anything, communication would have to substitute as our warranty. What is the best/easiest form of communication for an MMO??? A FORUM! Mythic is denying us of that form of communication, one that is available for every other MMO out there.

    
    Lastly, Mark is just making things worse for himself if he is really so scared of "mean" posts because now everyone has even more of a reason to hate him.

     

    Sorry, that's completely incorrect. Not only is your car analogy a terrible comparison to what is actually going on here, you have a twisted perception of how in-game feedback works. First, the feedback system ensures that player feedback is ALWAYS received and NEVER overlooked. In a forum, you will have to fight with the tens of thousands of other people experiencing problems and constantly bumping your thread to make sure you're heard.

    Not to mention, most people end up making ten thousand threads on the same issue because they can't use the "search" function.

    A quick look around some fansite forums will show you quite the opposite about how the playerbase feels about official forums. Warhammer Alliance, for example, generally backs what Mark Jacobs is doing. Your generalization that every player is discontent with Mark's decision is not only a bold one to make without proof, but also completely wrong. If you took only 15 seconds to read around fansites or other community forums, you would see just how wrong you are.

     

    Sorry to say man but you are either blind or full of crap. You must not actually be reading the threads at warhammer alliance. Go to their forums and do a search for MARK. Most of the people there do NOT care for his views.

    My car anaology was spot on. This article is mostly about accountability and again you wouldn't expect a car manufacturer to skip on their  warranty. Just like you wouldn't expect an MMO to skip on their forum. The two just go hand in hand.

    Additionally, there isn't competition on a forum unless your idea is just off the wall. Generally, when you get a following of people with the same impressions, the post is looked at in depth. If a post has a large enough following, it might even be stickied.

    Lastly, having worked as a CSR for two major companies (which I will never do again) I have a little experience in how feedback is handled. True, I have not worked for Mythic so I don't know their practices first hand however if Mark is any indication of how things are handled ... it is the same as every other two places I worked. That is to say, we were told to flat out ignore most of the feedback unless it could be categorized under their current goals. Basically, if it didn't agree with the developers already laid out plans, ignore it.

    Both Mythic and even even Funcom have expressed that their word is law and they already have a vision of how they want their game to be. We see how well that is going for Funcom....

  • Posted: 9/28/08 6:47 PM
    General Discussion
• • Warhammer Online : Age of Reckoning: Jacobs on GOA, Forums and Accountability

  • Originally posted by NotArkard
    

    Very well said, Mark. You should know that most of us who have played DAoC understand that we do not need official forums to form a community. Communities are formed within the game, and while at this time, everyone's off doing their own thing, eventually things will settle down like they did in DAoC. Known players will be known within the game on their own server, and they don't need to go off posting "I KILLED X PLAYER 10 TIMES IN RVR LOLOLOL I'M SO GOOD" threads on any official forum.

     

    Those who don't understand what a community is really like, or haven't played DAoC, as you said will vote with their credit card. Maybe they'll go back to reading awesome threads on the WoW forums such as:

     

    1. "LOLOL THORI'DAL WENT TO A ROGUE"

    2. @LEGOLESS I PWNT U!!111!

    And so on, and so forth.

     
    
    I couldn't agree with you more ...

     

    Oh wait, I don't agree. Why? Because War's in game chat system is clunky, buggy and just overall doesn't provide a communicative experience.

    
    Personally, at this point I would just prefer a better in game chat system although I still would like an official forum. Problem is, how do I relay my distaste for their in game chat system? I guess I could submit feedback in game that will get lost in the millions or if there were a forum I could create a post for such an issue and hope to get many other users to support the same idea. An idea that is supported goes farther than just one person alone.

    
    Sure, you are going to get people being rude on an official forum ... just as you will an unofficial. The only difference is that Mythic isn't the one having to moderate at that point. Also, if they actually read the unofficial forums as they claim to, they are going to read the same nasty posts as they would have on an official forum. One difference being, depending on the moderation rules of the site, the nasty posts may just stay there to continuously slap Mythic in the face.

    
    What this is really about is accountability, money and laziness. They don't want to spend money on a forum when they can have unofficial sites do their work for them. Then, when people start posting reasonable requests/feedback, Mythic can simply claim not to have seen the posts and not been aware of the issues. In one swing they have given up accountability and shown how lazy they really are.

    
    It's like a car manufacturer trying to sell a car without a warranty. They don't want to be accountable for the problems that may occur and have to spend revenue to fix the problems.

    
    With an MMO, we get no warranty. Matter of fact, we have to sign an EULA telling us exactly what we CANNOT DO with the software we just spent our money on. So if anything, communication would have to substitute as our warranty. What is the best/easiest form of communication for an MMO??? A FORUM! Mythic is denying us of that form of communication, one that is available for every other MMO out there.

    
    Lastly, Mark is just making things worse for himself if he is really so scared of "mean" posts because now everyone has even more of a reason to hate him.

  • Posted: 9/27/08 1:56 PM
    General Discussion
• • Rebirth of AC

  • Strip it back to 1999, yes. Make it free with ads, no.

    Update the graphics engine majorly, not that little crap tweak they did with the expansion.

    Personally, I left because they tweaked the game so far beyond what made it great but to come back now I would need it to be like the original with updated graphics. What can I say, I am a graphics whore now.

  • Posted: 9/24/08 4:43 PM
    Asheron's Call
• • Warhammer Online : Age of Reckoning: Jacobs on GOA, Forums and Accountability

  • Eh, he "feels passionate" about everything he does.

     

     

    Damn right a customer has the right to be upset; we also have the right to complain if the product doesn't work right. You accepted out money, now you have to take the heat when it doesn't work right. It's called being help accountable!

    It's a complete cop out not to have a forum and give the excuse he did. Oh, people said some mean things... GTF over it! We wouldn't say "mean" things if you got your act together.

    So sure, you block out the complaints but you also block out the suggestions. In your arrogance, you miss what the player base is looking for ... what is wrong with your game. After the frustration, people move on and you are left twiddling your thumbs wondering what happened.

    Congratulations, you get the genius of the year award!

     

     

    Edit: Btw, its exponentially harder to gain a customer back from cancellation than it is to retain a custom prior to that. Telling customers to cancel, sure we are going to do that ... most wont look back. Then you get to pass the buck to someone else...

     

    Personally, I have NEVER! returned to a game that I have canceled due to bugs/content. Once the time I have paid for runs out, I am gone for good.

     

     

  • Posted: 9/24/08 4:21 PM
    General Discussion