Profile: redcap036
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• • How I got converted to Soloism today ><

  • Originally posted by klapdoor
    

    Originally posted by vesavius
    

    Originally posted by klapdoor
    

    Originally posted by vesavius
    

    Originally posted by klapdoor
    

    ...something that isn't an opinion, but fact: The current genre called MMORPGs evolved from its predecessor called MUD's. For those of you who weren't even born at the height of its popularity: MUDs were text based online adventure RPG's. The world was build up out of small sections/chambers, each with its own description, possible occupants/enemies and directions/exits. The whole goal of the game was to be able to have a fun adventure in an environment that would constantly be updated and expanded. It was a hobby and a passion, designed by and for people who craved the style of those early dungeon crawling games (like Zork for example), but would like to play in an (nearly) endless world and meet other like minded adventurers on your path. A few facts on MUDs related to this 'discussion':

    - Grouping essentially did not exist. Most MUDs were not designed with grouping in mind and the technology at the time did not encourage it. You could 'band' together, but that was meant as a sociable and mostly roleplaying option. It was not a requirement.

    - Adventure and story line were the key words. The most successful MUDs were those who had the best designed environment and quests (remember, still text only).

    - Min/max-ing was something essentially unheard of. In most MUDs you could allocate your basic stat points, and you could sure 'gimp' yourself if you allocated wrongly, but in almost all cases you could still adventure through the world without any issues. In fact, a lot of people 'gimped' their characters on purpouse as it was a lot of fun to do (oh damn, again that word 'fun'), in true pen and paper D&D style.

    - Unfortunately most of this changed in the latest generations of MUDs onward.

    Eh? What are you banging on about? When were we talking about MUDs? Why the unasked for history lesson in what we all know?

    May as well talk about D&D... or Chainmail even...

    One builds on the other, sure, but you are ludicrous to talk about the MUD model when we are discussing MMORPGs.

    They are a very different animal, so everything you bothered to type here is irrellevant in the discussion.

    Gotta love psuedo intellectuals eh?

    I'm truly sorry that my 'unasked-for history lesson' so thoroughly confused you, but I cannot be bothered to put it all in simpeler terms. Yet if you realy want to make the argument of it being a different animal, then you should start considering that games like WoW are the next step in the evolution of the MMO genre...

    As should have been obvious from what I wrote, It wasnt what you wrote the confused me, just why you wrote it.

    Simpler terms are really not necessary, I promise, but a I am still confused by your need to give an unasked for history lesson... That has nothing to do with the discussion at hand... Bewildering.

    It isn't as bewildering as you think if you understand why I wrote that. But it seems that your own opinion on how the MMO genre should suit your own needs, makes you unable to grasp the argument made by that 'bewildering history lesson'.
    

    (Hmmm, running out of colours if this continues)

     

    I am starting to think maybe English isnt your first language? If it isnt, then thats cool, and I apologise. It's just that you seem to have comprehension issues.

    It is an easy step to check my profile, as I did with yours btw. As you played the 'native English incomprehension card' twice, please proofread and check your own posts first, before trying it out on other people...

    There is no comprehension issue here. It is just that you are trying to force your own opinion on others, using a few simple semantic issues here and there. This is a sign of weak argumentation as you are unable to see the general picture and have to resort to belittlement.

     

    And I do blame this on the current crop of MMO players. But essentially they cannot help it though. They grew up with the games that are all about competition and missed those earlier games that were still about the adventure of the game (it is no coincidence that the whole genre of old style adventure games like Zork, Monkey island, Sam & Max, etc. has completely died out).

    Erm... friend, they havent.

    Point'n'Click adventures are still made, and Sam and Max are still selling...

    Just because you have stopped looking, it dosent mean they stopped existing.

    Who are you blaming now?

    Ah yes, I concede to you this one. The financial success of adventure games is still huge these days. No wonder there are still countless numbers of these games produced every year. Maybe I shouldn't have used the term 'died out', I can see where it has confused you.

    And btw, I don't think we'll ever be able to be friends.

    Thank you, I accept your admission of being wrong.

    But, actually, you said completely died out. This is a clear and definitive statement being presented as fact.

    See, here is a great example of latching on to one word while ignoring the rest. So to help you out, here is my revised sentence:
    

    (it is no coincidence that the whole genre of old style adventure games like Zork, Monkey island, Sam & Max, etc. has almost disappeared from the gaming scene in general in such a way that Vesavius is able to understand that it has become a small niche market. This with the purpose to show Vesavius that although some people still play the genre (myself included), it is no way comparable anymore to its heydays in the 80's and early 90's)

     

    You see, you 'confuse' people when you make definitive statements that are incorrect. They tend to think you mean what you are typing. I guess thats their fault though, and not yours.

    Never friends though? awww..... For real?  :(

     

    Now to those who are saying that because MM-ORPG stands for Massive Multiplayer you need to group and otherwise just sod off, read again from which genre the current MMORPG evolved.

    And read again how irrellevant that whole verbal gush was that you posted above is to discussing MMORPGs.

    Oh, and then sod off?

    Why should I sod off? Cannot take an argument? I also see that you conveniently glossed over the whole RP part of the post, guess that didn't fit in with your personal view after all...
    

    And why should anyone else sod off, but you don't seem to have a problem telling them to...

    Ah, talking about comprehension issues...

     

    Cannot you take an argument?

    My post was in direct response to yours after all, as is obvious right?

    Hypocrite much?

    And again you're glossing over the RP part, very interesting you know.
    

     

    And a few last things, funny quotes:

    Originally posted by vesavius

    My, arnt you a rude little man?

    MMORPGs were designed for co-op play.

    Yes you can solo, but it should never be preferable to group.

    As soon as you build a game that enforces solo play then you destroy what made these games special in the first.

    Community.

    /sigh... who am I kidding..? As if your ever gonna get it.... From your attitude of post here I doubt very much much that you are capable of social co-op play.

     

    Funny how you think that 'Community' can only be achieved by forced grouping. And no, originally the genre was not designed for co-op play. That is like saying that FPS was originally designed for co-op play.

    Read what I wrote again.

    and again if you need to.

    To help you, what I wrote means that a game that ENFORCES soloing, as the current generation does by removing group content, or at least marganalising it to the point where it is worthless, will never have a community worth spit.

    You see, this is where I do not understand people.

    Yes, your right, you blatantly don't understand people. 

    You guys are blubbering tears because you feel that the whole 'effort' of putting together a group should entitle you to some special treat.

    No, we are making the point that we enjoy co-op social gameplay.

    I really do't know how to paint this clearer for you. 

    You don't have to. But what is holding you back from enjoying your social gameplay? Other people soloing?

     

    As you clearly are not a fan of 'history lessons'

    Actually, I am when they are from an informed source and relevant. 

    I'll keep it short and simple for you:

    Thanks!

    Do you group for the 'community feel' and the fun of grouping? Or do you group because you will then be able to get that special treat?

    I group for the enjoyment of achieveing a shared goal with friends (both new and old). I group for chats, for laughs, to share the experience of exploring a new world.

    Oh, and I also play MMORPGs to develop and imporve my character, which in your simplistic terms would those 'special treats' I guess.

    So, both.

    Again, what is holding you back from your envisioned experience?
    

     

    I have never called for enforced grouping.

    I have only ever stated that enforced soloing in these games destroys community. Whether you take that as opinion or fact, I don't really care tbh.

    Point me in the direction of those games that enforces soloing? (and please do not come with some obscure f2p garbage example)

    AoC enforced soloing for 90% of it's content at launch.

    You mean Tortage? Maybe you have never played the game, but it is certainly possible to group up, even for quite a bit in the 10-20 levels. Although most people who have only read about the game think otherwise though...

     

    I have soloed when I have needed or wanted to in MMORPGs since 1999, and it should always be there as an option. I have stated this already in this thread. Read it again.

    Good boy!! So you do know how to solo...

     Yep! I am sooo proud!

    If you havent got a point, pleae dont invent one by putting words in my mouth to suit whatever it is you are obviously so desperate to say.

    There is nothing desperate in my previous post, unless you call a civil grown-up way of argumentation 'desperate'. Although I admit that I have lowered my standard considerably in this reply, much to my regret I must say.
    

     Just calling it as I am reading it.

    Was the only way to get 'face to face' with you unfortunately. Ah, how I love these little jibes on a saturday afternoon.

     

    Seeing as you think MMORPGs as a genre started with the MUDs, which is just plain silly, it's like saying that cars are the same as wagons

    Gee, let me see: Four wheels, used for carrying cargo from point A to point B and powered by horsepower. Ah how wrong I have been!!!
    

    hehe this is my favourite bit!

    If you can't see why, I really havent the energy to point it out :)

    By the way, what I will say, is that a car isnt actually powered by 'horsepower'... y'know? They don't actually have horses inside them... It's just a term to measure power borrowed from wagons... y'know?

    Again here you go, not able to see the whole picture just to make it suit your own needs.

     

    What you do here is actually prove my point though, so thanks.

    You see, cars have borrowed terms from wagons (horsepower in this case), the same way that MMORPGs borrowed from MUDs, but they...

    Funny thing is, you prove my point, but use the wrong word. Now I could do the same as you did and dismiss your argument on the word 'borrowed' (should be derived), yet I'm able to see the whole picture.

     

    Ahh no matter lol. Anyone who actually says what you said won't get it.

    You mean anyone like you?

     

    and you obviously cannot comprehend basic English yet still attempt to ridicule what is said with some kind of false superiority complex, forgive me if I just leave you now and don't bother replying to you anymore.

    Ah yes, the obligatory mudslinging... Thanks for the laughs 'friend'...

    A pleasure :)

    It's so fun talking to you, I can't help but reply, so I take that back! :)

     

    Well, it is never a good sign to see someone come back on a promise, no matter how many smilies you put behind it.
    

     

     

    +10 points for being in color!

  • Posted: 11/22/08 10:31 AM
    General Discussion
• • Well, Then, Saga of Ryzom is Free

  • Originally posted by Sasi
    

     

    ---

    Originally posted by redcap036
    Every MMO has it's "STFU j00 n00b" crowd at least in Ryzom there are far fewer of them and they tend not to last very long...

     

    How long you been playing again?

    ---

     

    He's been playing for several years, and in my experience he's closer to correct than the small number I've heard complain about some sort of elitist attitude. It is true that during a short few weeks this year the normally very hospitable and polite community got overrun by a very large number of new players, many of whom did not have clear understanding of what to expect from what they seemed to consider a "new F2P game", nor did many of them respect the standards of the community and in particular the standards for the Universe Chat channel, which is intended solely for answering questions about immediate game matters, and not for lengthy diatribes or arguments.

    During that time some people got short tempered and blew up at having to repeat the same conversation for the Nth time, with people who insisted that because they didn't like a certain game mechanic, the game was "crap", or some variation of that. Most of the people displaying that "elitist" attitude were not actually veteran players, but there is no way for a new player to know that. And a few actual veterans displayed behavior not normally tolerated, as well.

    If you were to visit again today, you would find that there are still some raw feelings from that experience, but by and large the community has returned to its norm, and people who act childishly are fairly quickly taken to task by the community and the moderators.

     

    ---

    Originally posted by redcap036
    so if you think it's normal it's probaly because you've never been caught... your's truely A Fanboi

     

    See there you go again a true Ryzom fanboi with that holier than thou attitude and with that, I'll just re-state my last comment,
    "it's this one track minded response's that the Ryzom fanboi's give" that put me off of playing this game. "

    ---

     

    While Mach may have crossed the line a touch with his emotional comment, his argument was fairly logical. Certain actions have been adjudged by the GMs to be exploiting. If you engage in those activities, and someone points it out to you, you should probably take it as a favor that they are helping you avoid unpleasant consequences. We've discussed this particular matter already, regarding terrain features, so I won't belabor it, other than to say that I've never found the rules of the game to be burdensome. If someone was less than pleasant in their comments to you, all I can do is offer my apologies and assure you that the vast majority of us do no such thing.

     

    ---

    Originally posted by redcap036
    In fact I can state quite strongly that it's the holier than thou attitude from the fanboi's that put's me off of this game and not the lack of jump or the ability to use normal combat tactic's, it's the persecution for just asking about it or wanting to talk about it that makes me sick of Ryzom and stop's me coming back and playing on. 

    ---

     

    It's quite apparent that you tried the game, and someone or a few someones got on your nerves. It's equally apparent that you are generalizing your anger to a whole community, and by extension to the whole game. It is no surprise that not everyone is going to enjoy a given game, for any number of reasons. Your complaint is a valid point of information, and I can assure you that the Ryzom community has recognized some problems and is actively rectifying them. I hope you enjoy whatever activities you pursue now, and perhaps someday you'll be of a mind to come visit us again, and I hope if that happens you'll have a better experience.

    Speaking only from my own experience, and leaving out the hundreds, perhaps thousands of glowing reports others have given about the community in Ryzom, I can say that in no other MMORPG that I have tried, and I have tried many, have I found a community as welcoming, helpful, polite, and mature than the community in Ryzom. I'm truly sorry that you are among the few who experienced otherwise.

    I also hope that I can serve as a counterargument, and perhaps serve as an example of what the "real" Ryzom community is like. I'm in no way exceptional in the community, except perhaps in my willingness to spend my time here in the den of flames.

    
     

    Ok thank you for your comments, I will keep them in mind and I most likely will try my hand at it again, in the near future, but for now it will have to wait in my game queue, while I play others for now.

    Maybe the dev's at ryzom should get rid of the silly one foot high fence in the training area that surrounds the compound, it's this 1ft high fence that starts the arguments about jumping, make it a 4-6ft high fence with bars or chain link or pretty vines with flowers, what ever and people won't complain about not being able to jump,( because they won't be trying to jump a 1ft fence and finding out they can't, so they ask why not and guess what sort of replies they get back,) now I'm not saying this is the only reason, but this is where it pretty much starts, fix the fence and you will quite the," What No jumping?" complaint's down and maybe some of your longer term players might not get so annoyed at being asked the same question over and over again, anyway just a thought.

    Thanks again for hearing me and not accussing me,( this is very refreshing and gets you respect points)
     

  • Posted: 11/22/08 2:42 AM
    The Saga of Ryzom
• • Well, Then, Saga of Ryzom is Free

  • Originally posted by Machieltje
    

    Originally posted by redcap036
    

    Don't like games were I get accused of being a Jumping bunny boi or a game exploiter, just because I ask a question about jumping or standing on a hill and targeting my prey below,( which is normal in pretty much any other game ) It's not that you even have these as game rules, it's the," you must only want to bunny hop all over the place!" comments we get, when we ask about jumping or even suggest that it be added to the game." it's this one track minded response's that the Ryzom fanboi's give" that put me off of playing this game.
     

     

    I admit there have been some harsh comments about jumping though I haven't seen any after the initial rush. What's left now is a community (im)patiently awaiting developements and while there probably still are some rude and unpleasant players left most of the players in Ryzom are friendly helpful people, judging them based on a few bad expreriences,or worse on what you read on this forum, simply isn't fair. Every MMO has it's "STFU j00 n00b" crowd at least in Ryzom there are far fewer of them and they tend not to last very long...

     

    As to standing on hills killing mobs, you can do that all you like as long as there's a way for the mob to get to you. The Ryzom community didn't make the rules about exploiting; the dev team did. Probably because they though it wasn't fair that some people would get to gain experience without any risks and they may have a point there. Oh and I'm willing to bet that most, if not all, MMO's consider killing from a safe spot (risk free) exploiting so if you think it's normal it's probaly because you've never been caught...

     

    your's truely

     

    A Fanboi

    
     

    Every MMO has it's "STFU j00 n00b" crowd at least in Ryzom there are far fewer of them and they tend not to last very long...

    
    How long you been playing again?

    so if you think it's normal it's probaly because you've never been caught... your's truely A Fanboi

    See there you go again a true Ryzom fanboi with that holier than thou attitude and with that, I'll just re-state my last comment,

    "it's this one track minded response's that the Ryzom fanboi's give" that put me off of playing this game. "

    In fact I can state quite strongly that it's the holier than thou attitude from the fanboi's that put's me off of this game and not the lack of jump or the ability to use normal combat tactic's, it's the persecution for just asking about it or wanting to talk about it that makes me sick of Ryzom and stop's me coming back and playing on.
     

  • Posted: 11/21/08 12:19 PM
    The Saga of Ryzom
• • WOW: Lich King sells 2.8m in 24 hours

  • Originally posted by Lence
    

    Blizzard has announced that second of World of Warcraft expansion Wrath of the Lich King racked up 2.8 million sales worldwide in its first 24 hours on release.

    This makes it the fastest-selling PC game ever released. It also keeps the title in the family; the previous record-holder was first WOW expansion The Burning Crusade, which managed 2.4 million in one day in January last year.

    Most of those 2.8 million sales will have come from North America and Europe, although Lich King benefited from the addition of Chile, Argentina and Russia to Blizzard's domain. Australasia and south-east Asia got the expansion a day or two later, and China's still waiting.

    World of Warcraft has 11 million players worldwide now, versus the 8 million it had when Burning Crusade launched - so in terms of sell-through to subscribers, Lich King performed fractionally less well than its predecessor.

    The 3.5 million copies Burning Crusade sold in its first month will be the next of its own records Blizzard is looking to beat. One analyst has predicted that Lich King could net 5 million in the same period, according to Gamasutra.

    
     

    And how many copies were bought by Gold farmers?

  • Posted: 11/20/08 8:02 PM
    World of Warcraft
• • Well, Then, Saga of Ryzom is Free

  • Don't like games were I get accused of being a Jumping bunny boi or a game exploiter, just because I ask a question about jumping or standing on a hill and targeting my prey below,( which is normal in pretty much any other game ) It's not that you even have these as game rules, it's the," you must only want to bunny hop all over the place!" comments we get, when we ask about jumping or even suggest that it be added to the game." it's this one track minded response's that the Ryzom fanboi's give" that put me off of playing this game.
     

  • Posted: 11/20/08 7:59 PM
    The Saga of Ryzom